Exegetical and Hermeneutical Commentary of 2 Corinthians 10:6
And having in a readiness to revenge all disobedience, when your obedience is fulfilled.
6. and having in a readiness ] The expression is equivalent to our holding ourselves in readiness.
to revenge ] Better, to avenge. Literally, to do justice, execute sentence upon.
when your obedience is fulfilled ] St Paul was ready to wait until his exhortations and rebukes had had time to work. He would not ‘come to them in heaviness’ (ch. 2Co 2:1). He called ‘God to witness that if he did delay to come to Corinth it was to spare them’ (ch. 2Co 1:23). He wrote while absent that he might not have to use sharpness when present (ch. 2Co 13:10). But when all had been done that could be done, it was his intention to come and ‘not spare’ those who refused to listen to his voice (ch. 2Co 13:2).
Fuente: The Cambridge Bible for Schools and Colleges
And having in a readiness … – I am ready to punish all disobedience, notwithstanding all that is said to the contrary; see the notes on 2Co 10:1-2. Clothed as I am with this power; aiming to subdue all things to Christ, though the weapons of my warfare are not carnal, and though I am modest or timid 2Co 10:1 when I am with you, I am prepared to take any measures of severity required by my apostolic office, in order that I may inflict deserved punishment on those who have violated the laws of Christ. The design of this is, to meet the objection of his enemies, that he would not dare to execute his threatenings.
When your obedience is fulfilled – Doddridge renders this: now your obedience is fulfilled, and the sounder part of your church restored to due order and submission. The idea seems to be, that Paul was ready to inflict discipline when the church had showed a readiness to obey his laws, and to do its own duty – delicately intimating that the reason why it was not done was the lack of entire promptness in the church itself, and that it could not be done on any offender as long as the church itself was not prepared to sustain him. The church was to discountenance the enemies of the Redeemer; to show an entire readiness to sustain the apostle, and to unite with him in the effort to maintain the discipline of Christs house.
Fuente: Albert Barnes’ Notes on the Bible
Verse 6. And having in a readiness to revenge all disobedience] I am ready, through this mighty armour of God, to punish those opposers of the doctrine of Christ, and the disobedience which has been produced by them.
When your obedience is fulfilled.] When you have in the fullest manner, discountenanced those men, and separated yourselves from their communion. The apostle was not in haste to pull up the tares, lest he should pull up the wheat also.
All the terms in these two verses are military. Allusion is made to a strongly fortifed city, where the enemy had made his last stand; entrenching himself about the walls; strengthening all his redoubts and ramparts; raising castles, towers, and various engines of defence and offence upon the walls; and neglecting nothing that might tend to render his strong hold impregnable. The army of God comes against the place and attacks it; the strong holds , all the fortified places, are carried. The imaginations, , engines, and whatever the imagination or skill of man could raise, are speedily taken and destroyed. Every high thing, , all the castles and towers are sapped, thrown down and demolished; the walls are battered into breaches; and the besieging army, carrying every thing at the point of the sword, enter the city, storm and take the citadel. Every where defeated, the conquered submit, and are brought into captivity, , are led away captives; and thus the whole government is destroyed.
It is easy to apply these things, as far as may be consistent with the apostle’s design. The general sense I have given in the preceding notes.
Fuente: Adam Clarke’s Commentary and Critical Notes on the Bible
The apostle certainly means by this, excommunication; which was the rod which he had before mentioned, asking them if they would he should come unto them with a rod. This rod he here threateneth them with; telling them, that he had another weapon of his warfare, of a spiritual nature too, to be used against such as preferred themselves to be believers, but walked disorderly; only he at present spared them, because though a great part of them were obedient, yet there were some amongst them of whose obedience he could not yet glory; but yet he hoped well, and therefore should wait until, by the use of all fair means, (such as exhortations and arguments), he had reduced as many of them as he could unto obedience. But that being done, God had intrusted him with another weapon, with which he would, in the name and by the authority of God, revenge his glory upon the disobedience of others. Herein the apostle hath set a rule and a pattern to all churches, where are multitudes that walk disorderly; not to be too hasty in excommunicating them, but to proceed gradually; first using all fair means, and waiting with all patience, for the reducing them to their duty, who will by any gentle and fair means be reduced; and then revenging the honour and glory of God only upon such as will not be reclaimed.
Fuente: English Annotations on the Holy Bible by Matthew Poole
6. Translate, “Havingourselves (that is, being) in readiness to exact punishmentfor all disobedience,” c. We have this in store for thedisobedient: it will be brought into action in due time.
when your obedience,&c.He charitably assumes that most of the Corinthian Churchwill act obediently therefore he says “YOURobedience.” But perhaps some will act otherwise; in order,therefore, to give all an opportunity of joining the obedient, hewill not prematurely exact punishment, but wait until the full numberof those gathered out to Christ has been “completed,” andthe remainder have been proved incorrigible. He had acted already soat Corinth (Ac 18:6-11;compare Exo 32:34; Mat 13:28-30).
Fuente: Jamieson, Fausset and Brown’s Commentary Critical and Explanatory on the Whole Bible
And having in a readiness to revenge all disobedience,…. Not with the temporal sword, as the civil magistrate, but with the spiritual one; meaning either censures and excommunication, which a faithful minister of the Gospel, with the suffrage of the church, has at hand, and a power to make use of, for the reclaiming of disobedient persons; or rather that extraordinary power which was peculiar to the apostles, of inflicting punishments on delinquents, such as what was exercised by Peter upon Ananias and Sapphira, by the Apostle Paul on Elymas the sorcerer, the incestuous person, and Hymenaeus and Philetus, and which still continued with him; it was ready at hand, he could exercise it whenever he pleased, he only waited a proper time:
when your obedience is fulfilled: till they were thoroughly reformed from the several abuses, both in doctrine and practice, they had fallen into, and were brought into a better order and decorum, and appeared to have been in all things obedient to the directions he had given; being unwilling, as yet, to use the awful authority he had from Christ, lest any of the dear children of God, who were capable of being restored by gentler methods, should suffer with the refractory and incorrigible.
Fuente: John Gill’s Exposition of the Entire Bible
Being in readiness ( ). This very idiom occurs in Polybius, Philo, etc. “Holding in readiness.” In 12:14 we have for the same idea (adverb ).
Disobedience (). Rare word (Plato, papyri) hearing amiss (aside), failing to hear, refusing to heed (cf. Mt 18:17 for same idea in ). In N.T. only here; Rom 5:19; Heb 2:2. In contrast with (obedience) rather than the common (Rom 11:30; Rom 11:32).
When your obedience shall be fulfilled ( ). Indefinite temporal clause with and first aorist passive subjunctive. Paul expects that the whole church will become obedient to Christ’s will soon as came true.
Fuente: Robertson’s Word Pictures in the New Testament
To avenge all disobedience, etc. The military metaphor continued. After most have surrendered and thus fulfilled their obedience, some rebels may remain, and these will be punished.
Fuente: Vincent’s Word Studies in the New Testament
1) “And having in a readiness,” (kai en hetoimo echontes) “and having or holding (ourselves) in readiness;” being ready, to reprove with great sharpness those of the church who persisted in other carnal matters which he had reproved in his former letter of 1Corinthians, 2Co 13:2; 2Co 13:10.
2) “To revenge all disobedience,” (ekdikesai pasan parakoen) “to avenge all (kind of) disobedience,” to punish all who go on in disobedience. Perhaps the punishment was to be to exclude those who did not amend their ways of gross error, as the young man who was excluded for taking his father’s wife, 1Co 5:1; 1Co 5:4-5; 1Co 5:11; 1Co 5:13; 2Co 2:6-8.
3) “When your obedience is fulfilled,” (hotan plerothe humon te hupakon) “Whenever your obedience is fulfilled,” or you all have kept or fulfilled your promise; 2Co 2:6-9. When he learned they had restored and were trying to help the erring, fallen, excluded young man who had been guilty of fornication or incest, Gal 6:1. They were also to receive Titus and the other two unnamed brethren with respect and support, 2Co 7:15.
Fuente: Garner-Howes Baptist Commentary
6. And are in readiness to avenge. This he adds, lest insolent men should presumptuously lift themselves up in opposition to his ministry, as if they could do so with impunity. Hence he says, that power had been given him — not merely for constraining voluntary disciples to subjection to Christ, but also for inflicting vengeance upon the rebellious, (759) and that his threats were not empty bugbears, (760) but had the execution quite in readiness — to use the customary expression. Now this vengeance is founded on Christ’s word —
whatsoever ye shall bind on earth shall be bound also in heaven. (Mat 18:18.)
For although God does not thunder forth immediately on the minister’s pronouncing the sentence, yet the decision is ratified, (761) and will be accomplished in its own time. Let it, however, be always understood, that it is when the minister fights with spiritual armor. Some understand it as referring to bodily punishments, by means of which the Apostles inflicted vengeance upon contumacious and impious persons; as for example, Peter struck Ananias and Sapphira dead, and Paul struck Elymas the sorcerer blind. (Act 5:1, and Act 13:6.) But the other meaning suits better, for the Apostles did not make use of that power invariably or indiscriminately. Paul, however, speaks in general terms that he has vengeance ready at hand against all the disobedient.
When your obedience shall be fulfilled How prudently he guards against alienating any by excessive severity! For as he had threatened to inflict punishment upon the rebellious, that he may not seem to provoke them, he declares that another duty had been enjoined upon him with regard to them — simply that of making them obedient to Christ. And, unquestionably, this is the proper intention of the gospel, as he teaches both in the commencement and in the close of the Epistle to the Romans. (Rom 1:5, and Rom 16:26.) Hence all Christian teachers ought carefully to observe this order, that they should first endeavor with gentleness to bring their hearers to obedience, so as to invite them kindly before proceeding to inflict punishment upon rebellion. (762) Hence, too, Christ (763) has given the commandment as to loosing before that of binding. (764)
(759) “ Des-rebelles et obstinez;” — “Upon the rebellious and obstinate.”
(760) “ Pour faire peur (comme on dit) aux petits enfans;” — “To frighten (as they say) little children.”
(761) “ Ferme et stable;” — “Firm and stable.”
(762) “ Auant qu’entrer a les menacer, et leur denoncer la peine de rebellion;” — “Before proceeding to threaten them, and denounce upon them the punishment of rebellion.”
(763) “ Et pour ceste cause Jesus Christ luy-mesme;” — “And for this reason Jesus Christ himself.”
(764) “Calvin manifestly alludes here to Joh 20:23, in commenting on which he says, “As the embassy of salvation and of eternal life has been committed to the Apostles, so, on the other hand, they have been armed with vengeance against all the ungodly, who reject the salvation offered to them, as Paul teaches. (2Co 10:6.) But this is placed in last order, because it was proper that the true and real design of preaching the gospel should be first exhibited. That we are reconciled to God belongs to the nature of the gospel; that believers are adjudged to eternal life may be said to be accidentally connected with it. For this reason, Paul, in the passage which I lately quoted, when he threatens vengeance against unbelievers, immediately adds — after that your obedience shall have been fulfilled; (2Co 10:6) for he means, that it belongs peculiarly to the gospel to invite all to salvation, but that it is accidental to it that it brings destruction to any.” — Calvin on John, vol. 2, p. 273. — Ed.
Fuente: Calvin’s Complete Commentary
(6) And having in a readiness to revenge all disobedience.The idiom, having in a readiness, is perhaps, somewhat too archaic, and it might be better to render being ready, or holding ourselves ready. The words that follow imply the thought that those with which the verse opens were somewhat too unqualified. When he spoke of avenging all disobedience, he was not thinking of those to whom he writes, and whose repentance and obedience had filled him with so much joy (2Co. 7:6-13), but only of the rebellious remnant. He would wait till all had obeyed who were willing to obey. He does not indicate what form of vengeance he thought of taking, but we may think of some such severe discipline as that indicated by delivering to Satan, in 1Co. 5:5; 1Ti. 5:20, with a view, if it were possible, to their ultimate restoration. (Comp. 2Co. 13:3-10.)
Fuente: Ellicott’s Commentary for English Readers (Old and New Testaments)
6. Having Parallel with casting, in 2Co 10:5, both agreeing with we, in 2Co 10:3. Our apostle is describing the actual war which we are waging; and while depicting it in the grand imagery of 2Co 10:4-5, he is not for a moment forgetting the smaller enemies now in his front; for, as before remarked, they are included as the less in the greater.
Revenge A judicial term, punish.
All disobedience Such as is excited by the Christine party in Corinth.
Your obedience is fulfilled When the solid Church is fully unified, and brought to a perfect accord with its founder apostle, then will due penalty be received by the schismatics.
Fuente: Whedon’s Commentary on the Old and New Testaments
‘And being in readiness to avenge all disobedience, when your obedience shall be made full.’
The weapons of he and his fellow-workers being so effective Paul is sure of victory. These weapons will bring the Corinthians in obedience to him and to God. And they can be sure that once they have guaranteed their full obedience to him as God’s chosen Apostle, he will avenge the disobedience of his opponents on all who have opposed him. They will be dealt with as crushed rebels.
As the obedience is to be to him as an Apostle, we must see the disobedience as also reflecting disobedience to the Apostles, possibly as not following though the decisions of the Jerusalem council (Acts 15). Or he may be signifying that they are refusing to genuinely acknowledge Apostolic authority overall, rather falsely claiming such for themselves (2Co 11:13).
So once the battle is won those who have rebelled will be called to account, although he does not tell us in what way. The thought may be of exclusion from acknowledgement by the recognised worldwide church, their ‘delivering to Satan’ (1Co 5:5).
Fuente: Commentary Series on the Bible by Peter Pett
2Co 10:6. And having in a readiness, &c. Those whom the Apostle here addresses are the Corinthian converts, who had been too much influenced by the false apostle. Of him the Apostle seems to have no hopes, ch. 2Co 11:13-15 and therefore he every where threatens, and here particularly in the present and 11th verse, to make an example of him and his adherents, (if any were so obstinate as still to remain with him,) when he had brought back all the Corinthians whom he could hope to prevail upon. It should be remembered, that before this time the Apostle had smitten Elymas with blindness; and it is highly probable from this whole passage before us, that some other miracles of this awful kind had been wrought by him, though they are not recorded in scripture.
Fuente: Commentary on the Holy Bible by Thomas Coke
2Co 10:6 . The reverse side of the . . . just expressed. Although, namely, the . . . is the result of the apostolic warfare on the whole and in general, yet there remain exceptions persons, who do not surrender themselves captive to Christ’s dominion; there remains in contradistinction to the of others. Hence it is a part also of the complete work of victory to punish every . And this, says Paul, we are in readiness to execute, so soon as, etc. Bengel well says: “Zelus jam adest; prometur, cum tempus erit.” Paul does not speak of the action of war-captives at variance with the duty of obedience, to which they are taken bound (Hofmann). For this the threat, which would amount, in fact, to the avenging of every sin , would be too strong, and the following . . . would not be suitable. The must still be enemies who, after the victory, do not submit to the victo.
] in promptu habentes , also in Polyb. ii. 34. 2, and Philo, Leg. ad. Caj . p. 1011, 1029. See, in general, Wetstei.
] With this he turns to apply what was previously said of a general tenor ( . .) specially to the circumstances of the Corinthians, so that the conduct of the Judaistic teachers, who had intruded into Corinth and directed their doings against Paul, appears especially to be included in ; and the Corinthian church, a part of which had been led astray by those persons, is represented as not yet completely obedient, but as in the course of developing this complete obedience. When this development shall be completed (which till then makes a claim on my patience, “ne laedantur imbecilliores,” Bengel), that of every disobedience shall even as respects the situation of things at Corinth ensue. [301] Thus the apostle separates the interest of the church from that of the intruding seducers, and presents his relation to the church as one of forbearance and confidence, while his relation to his opponents is one of vengeance delaying its execution only for the sake of the church, which has not yet attained to full obedience a wise manipulation of the Divide et impera!
How
] is placed first with emphasis, to distinguish the church from those whose was to be punished. Hofmann, without ground, denies this emphasis, because does not stand before . The emphasis certainly falls, in the first instance , on ., and next not on ., but on .
[301] Lachmann, by a full stop, separates . . . wholly from what goes before, and connects it with what follows, so that the meaning results: “When your obedience shall have become complete, see to what lies before your eyes.” A precept strangely conditioned! And why should we give up the common punctuation, which yields a delicate touch quite characteristic of Paul?
Fuente: Heinrich August Wilhelm Meyer’s New Testament Commentary
6 And having in a readiness to revenge all disobedience, when your obedience is fulfilled.
Ver. 6. And having in a readiness ] Vengeance is every whit as ready in God’s hand, as in the minister’s mouth. See Mat 16:19 ; Mat 18:18 . Elisha hath his sword as well as Jehu and Hazael, 1Ki 19:17 . God hews men by his prophets and slays them by the words of his mouth, Hos 6:5 . By preaching, Christ many times smites the earth, Isa 11:4 ; his word lays hold on them, Zec 1:6 , and that which they have counted wind, hath become fire to devour them,Jer 5:13-14Jer 5:13-14 .
Fuente: John Trapp’s Complete Commentary (Old and New Testaments)
6. ] But perhaps some will not thus be subjected. In that case we are ready to inflict punishment on them: but not till every opportunity has been given them to join the ranks of the obedient; when your obedience (stress on ) shall have been completed . He does not mention any persons not the disobedient , but every (case of) disobedience , and throws out into strong relief, as charitably embracing all, or nearly all, those to whom he was writing. Lachmann, strangely, and as it seems to me most absurdly, puts a period at , and joins . , . More complete ignorance of the Apostle’s style, and non-appreciation of the fine edge of his hortatory irony, can hardly be evinced, than this.
Fuente: Henry Alford’s Greek Testament
2Co 10:6 . . . .: and being in readiness ( cf. chap. 2Co 12:14 ) to avenge all disobedience ( cf. Mat 18:17 ), sc. , if there remain any still disobedient, when your obedience, i.e. , to me and to my Apostolic authority ( cf. 2Co 2:9 , 2Co 7:15 ), shall be fulfilled . The word in 2Co 10:5 brings him back to this, the primary object of his letter. He does not wish to arrive in Corinth until the Church as a whole is firm in its loyalty to him.
Fuente: The Expositors Greek Testament by Robertson
revenge = avenge. Greek. ekdikeo. See Luk 18:3, and Compare 2Co 7:11.
disobedience. Greek. parakoe. See Rom 5:19.
fulfilled. Greek. pleroo. App-125.
Fuente: Companion Bible Notes, Appendices and Graphics
6.] But perhaps some will not thus be subjected. In that case we are ready to inflict punishment on them: but not till every opportunity has been given them to join the ranks of the obedient; when your obedience (stress on ) shall have been completed. He does not mention any persons-not the disobedient, but every (case of) disobedience, and throws out into strong relief, as charitably embracing all, or nearly all, those to whom he was writing. Lachmann, strangely, and as it seems to me most absurdly, puts a period at , and joins . , . More complete ignorance of the Apostles style, and non-appreciation of the fine edge of his hortatory irony, can hardly be evinced, than this.
Fuente: The Greek Testament
2Co 10:6. ) viz., , he says, we are ready [having ourselves in readiness]. We have zeal already; and it will be brought forth into action at the proper time.-, all) This has a more extensive meaning than , your, presently after.-, when) lest the weaker should be injured,[66] 2Co 10:8. This is the principal point of pastoral prudence. [Paul had already done something of this sort at Corinth, Act 18:7. On a similar principle, GOD exercises so great long-suffering as He does, in regard to an immense multitude of wicked men, till those things which can be gained thereby, have been drawn forth. See Exo 32:34.-V. g.]
[66] Were I prematurely before the time to revenge disobedience.-ED.
Fuente: Gnomon of the New Testament
2Co 10:6
2Co 10:6
and being in readiness to avenge all disobedience,-When he speaks of his readiness to avenge all disobedience, he certainly did not have in mind those to whom he writes, and whose repentance and obedience filled him with so much joy (2Co 7:6-13); but only to the rebellious remnant who had persisted in their disobedience.
when your obedience shall be made full.-He would wait till all who were willing had repented and were willing to obey. He does not indicate what form of vengeance he would administer, but possibly such severe discipline as that indicated by delivering to Satan (1Co 5:5; 1Ti 5:20, with a view, if it were possible, to their ultimate restoration (2Co 13:3-10).
Fuente: Old and New Testaments Restoration Commentary
in: 2Co 13:2, 2Co 13:10, Num 16:26-30, Act 5:3-11, Act 13:10, Act 13:11, 1Co 4:21, 1Co 5:3-5, 1Ti 1:20, 3Jo 1:10
when: 2Co 2:9, 2Co 7:15
Reciprocal: 2Ki 2:24 – cursed them Pro 26:3 – General Rom 6:17 – but ye 1Co 5:5 – deliver 2Co 1:23 – that 2Co 12:20 – and that 2Co 12:21 – and have not Gal 5:10 – bear 2Th 3:14 – obey
Fuente: The Treasury of Scripture Knowledge
2Co 10:6. This revenge is the same as that in chapter 7:11, being the Lord’s way of taking vengeance on the workers of unrighteousness. However, it cannot be accomplished without the cooperation of the Christian soldiers in the spiritual warfare. That is why Paul states the condition; when your obedience is fulfilled.
Fuente: Combined Bible Commentary
2Co 10:6. and being in readiness to avenge all disobedience, when your obedience is fulfilled. The sound and healthy party in the churchwhom the apostle identifies with the church itselfare here distinguished from the refractory spirits who required stringent measures of repression. But the right condition of the former was to be his first care, that is, their thorough recognition of his apostolic authority, which would be evinced by their obedience to his instructions; after that he would deal with the unruly.
Fuente: A Popular Commentary on the New Testament
That is, having in a readiness that which will revenge all disobedience upon refractory and stubborn offenders (namely, the power of excommunication) and both authority and ability to inflict such corporal punishment as he judged fit, by delivering them unto Satan; which power he resolved to make use of, when the greater part of them were, by their obedience to his admonitions, reduced to good order again.
Where note, That the apostle defers the excommunicating and censuring the offenders amongst them, they being very many, till he had, by exhortaiton and argument, brought over as many as possibly he could unto obedience. There is no place for severe remedies, when the diseases have taken and infected the whole church: the offenders in the church, when very many, cannot be easily punished; for when great multitudes are concerned, they are like to draw great multitudes after them.
The apostle’s practice in this case here, is a good pattern for our imitation, not to be too forward, rash, and hasty in denouncing the censures of the church, but to proceed prudently and gradually: first using all fair means and gentle methods, and waiting with all patience for the reducing them to their duty who will be reduced, and then revenging the glory and honour of God only upon such as will by no means be reclaimed or reduced.
Fuente: Expository Notes with Practical Observations on the New Testament
Verse 6 The power previously mentioned, was going to be used by Paul to punish those who insisted on disobeying God’s inspired apostle. He did, however, pause to give all those who would obey a chance to repent.
Fuente: Gary Hampton Commentary on Selected Books
and being in readiness to avenge all disobedience, when your obedience shall be made full. [For though we are indeed human, we do not contend after a human or worldly fashion (for our weapons are not slander, detraction, misrepresentation, etc., which are the methods employed by the world in overcoming opponents, but we use divine powers in our conflicts (1Co 4:19-21; 1Co 5:5), powers which are mighty in the sight of God to tear down defenses), and which can cast down all false human reasonings, sophistries and vain deductions, and every like thing which men presumptuously rear in opposition to the word of God, and which can bring every rebellious thought into captivity, so that it shall obey Christ. With this power, therefore, I am ready to come to punish all the disobedient; but I pause that all who desire to repent may do so, and after the number of the obedient is made full I will punish the rebellious remnant that remain. In verse 4 Paul evidently alludes to the crow, a large military engine with a great claw to it, which was used to pull down the walls of castles, forts and other strongholds. Stanley thinks that Paul has in mind in this passage certain military operations which occurred in Cilicia, the province in which he was born. In the hills and mountains of that locality, certain bands of pirates and robbers entrenched themselves, and for awhile withstood the Roman arms. Cicero made some headway in suppressing them, and on his return was honored with a Roman triumph, but the final victory was achieved by Pompey the generation before Paul was born. Pompey made great use of the crow, for he pulled down one hundred and twenty fortresses. But the crow was then in as general use as the cannon is now, and a writer would hardly be thought to refer to Gettysburg if he happened to use cannonading as a figure of speech. However, Pompey’s campaign is a useful bit of history, for it shows us how forceful the figure was which Paul employed.]
Fuente: McGarvey and Pendleton Commentaries (New Testament)
Verse 6
To revenge; to condemn and punish.
Fuente: Abbott’s Illustrated New Testament
Paul was ready to come to Corinth and punish all disobedience to God’s will and his own apostolic authority. However, he wanted to do that only after the whole church had made a clean break with the rebels in its midst. If the church would not stand with him in disciplining his unrepentant opponents, his discipline would not be effective. Unless any church as a whole is willing to support the discipline of its member or members, the discipline that its leaders seek to impose will be ineffective.